We haven't improved under Fairclough

Anything and everything related to Barnet FC

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby buzzlightyear » 13 Feb 2011, 22:29

It seems odd to me that nothing is being done about changing the status quo here. Is it a case of better the devil you know? (The devil being the Conference of course). There's not even the occasional comment of 'but a new manager might not be any better'?

Why have we allowed it to get to 30 games and in a truly appalling position without having at least tried 3 managers who aren't PF? PF is great as a caretaker manager and has proven himself at Conference level, but putting him back in the hot seat - temporary or not - is like not having a chance at someone who might turn things around. We needed to get rid of Stimson after the first Stevenage game then try out a few gambles. Instead we have left ourselves with 16 games left.

It took 22 games to find out Stimson should have gone and either TK feels PF will keep us up or he's already resigned to going down. Me, I can't see us surviving under PF as I don't think that a gradual turn around will be enough. We are like the titanic slowly turning away from that iceberg. :sad:
User avatar
buzzlightyear
 
Posts: 259
Joined: 23 Jan 2011, 23:18

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby John_Carp1 » 14 Feb 2011, 11:13

PF's main weakness is a lack of contacts in the Football League, due to his non-professional playing career, and his non-league management career. This was why he built such a poor team in the year he was replaced as manager the first time, because he took a punt on too many non-leaguers, and a lot didn't pay off.

During the transfer window, we did next to nothing to stop the rot. We signed an Oxford reject, a Wolves right back not good enough to get into our team, and Anthony Pulis. No strikers were signed, no money was spent. Once again, his dearth of contacts has come to the fore. He will probably be the right man for the job in the Conference, and for me, does have the ability to motivate players, and make them play football in a decent way (when he isn't playing 4-5-1 at home). But was he the right man to inject the squad with fresh talent to keep us up? No, and many of us said so when he was re-appointed.
Tony Kleanthous has not asked you your opinion on The Hive. This is because he doesn't care about your opinion. I think your opinion should matter.

Tony Kleanthous OUT.
John_Carp1
 
Posts: 102
Joined: 11 Feb 2011, 14:52

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby John_c » 14 Feb 2011, 14:16

John_Carp1 wrote:PF's main weakness is a lack of contacts in the Football League, due to his non-professional playing career, and his non-league management career. This was why he built such a poor team in the year he was replaced as manager the first time, because he took a punt on too many non-leaguers, and a lot didn't pay off.

During the transfer window, we did next to nothing to stop the rot. We signed an Oxford reject, a Wolves right back not good enough to get into our team, and Anthony Pulis. No strikers were signed, no money was spent. Once again, his dearth of contacts has come to the fore. He will probably be the right man for the job in the Conference, and for me, does have the ability to motivate players, and make them play football in a decent way (when he isn't playing 4-5-1 at home). But was he the right man to inject the squad with fresh talent to keep us up? No, and many of us said so when he was re-appointed.


With respect John, that is mere supposition on your part. What exactly do you know about what contacts PF has in football?
:geahh:

Proud Sponsor of Luisma Villa Lopez's Football Conference Winning Away Shirt. Season 2014/15

"Can't wait to hear the latest excuses from that bell end John C"
User avatar
John_c
 
Posts: 4980
Joined: 23 Jan 2011, 08:23

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby John_Carp1 » 14 Feb 2011, 15:03

He mentioned it in one of his fans forums. When you put it together with what the likes of Martin Allen (and Barry Fry on Friday) has said about his short tenure as Barnet manager, (e.g. he signed a host of players from friends recommendations and favours without seeing them play, for example Simon King), I don't see it as a huge leap to come to the conclusion I have.
Tony Kleanthous has not asked you your opinion on The Hive. This is because he doesn't care about your opinion. I think your opinion should matter.

Tony Kleanthous OUT.
John_Carp1
 
Posts: 102
Joined: 11 Feb 2011, 14:52

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby becbee » 14 Feb 2011, 15:09

If it had been generally appreciated just how good Simon King was going to be, do you really think Oxford United would have released him? Kingy was a gamble that paid off, just like several others have and many others haven't.
becbee
 
Posts: 7986
Joined: 22 Jan 2011, 11:43

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby John_Carp1 » 14 Feb 2011, 15:14

Martin Allen also signed Grazioli and Joe Gamble (who he coached at Reading) within days of signing as manager. It's just an example, and yes it is based partly on supposition, but PF's league signings in general have been weak at best, and you wonder whether half of these cast-offs who do nothing for Barnet are actually 'recommended' or just seen at reserve games.
Tony Kleanthous has not asked you your opinion on The Hive. This is because he doesn't care about your opinion. I think your opinion should matter.

Tony Kleanthous OUT.
John_Carp1
 
Posts: 102
Joined: 11 Feb 2011, 14:52

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby beeamazed » 14 Feb 2011, 15:58

You only have to look at Pulis's stats to know he's a wrong un.
26 league appearances by the age of 26, all out on loan to lower league clubs.
The supporters at these clubs almost to a man reckon he's complete cack.
Our beloved club is in a truly dreadful state...
beeamazed
 
Posts: 243
Joined: 22 Jan 2011, 13:24

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby GRH » 14 Feb 2011, 16:34

John_Carp1 wrote:Martin Allen also signed Grazioli and Joe Gamble (who he coached at Reading) within days of signing as manager. It's just an example, and yes it is based partly on supposition, but PF's league signings in general have been weak at best, and you wonder whether half of these cast-offs who do nothing for Barnet are actually 'recommended' or just seen at reserve games.


It's well documented that Martin Allen knew nothing about signing Grazioli until the chairman called him to say that Bristol Rovers were prepared to give him to us as part of the Agogo deal. Any manager would have said yes to that offer.

For Simon King, see Dean Sinclair, a player plucked from the reserve team of a league club. For Joe Gamble see Nicky Bailey. For every Adam Gross signed by Fairclough, there is a Mark Williams, or for every Ben Bowdtich there is a Tony Taggert.

All managers will make bad signing, you just hope they make more good than bad.

I always felt that under Fairclough, given a full season we stay up. Maybe not by much, but for me survival was the number one goal whilst The Hive was being established. Unfortunately I see what happened with Cottee and Still being repeated again.
User avatar
GRH
 
Posts: 2169
Joined: 22 Jan 2011, 10:36

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby LeftSideRun » 14 Feb 2011, 17:09

Someone in this thread commented on Fairclough saying it is difficult to attract players to a club at the bottom of the table. Whilst there might be a grain of truth in this, I think we all know what will attract a footballer to any club - money. Sadly, Barnet offer very low wages and that is the limiting factor on the calibre of player we're able to bring in.
LeftSideRun
 
Posts: 867
Joined: 26 Jan 2011, 11:26

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby amberforever » 14 Feb 2011, 17:40

Our kick off was wonderful to watch......our set pieces have improved!!!!
amberforever
 
Posts: 1805
Joined: 22 Jan 2011, 18:37

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby buzzlightyear » 14 Feb 2011, 20:39

dangerous wrote:we could do a lincoln and win the next 5...its a funny old game


But we won't because we do things the right way and don't just get rid of managers if they've been struggling a while so while we may avoid someone coming in who will be as bad or worse (though PF seems no better...) we don't get the opposite either. Yes it's risky changing managers all the time, but it doesn't seem to have resulted in teams going down - that seems to have been down to financial mismanagement. But we pride ourselves on doing things differently at Barnet.
User avatar
buzzlightyear
 
Posts: 259
Joined: 23 Jan 2011, 23:18

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby barnetboy1 » 14 Feb 2011, 20:58

Why have we allowed it to get to 30 games and in a truly appalling position without having at least tried 3 managers who aren't PF?

I'm sure PF was the "quick and easy answer",for all the obvious reasons,not least that he's already on the payroll.
It's ironic that,initially,it appeared we HAD improved under PF.TK must have breathed a huge sigh of relief.
Now it's all going t*ts-up.
I fear it's all about the money.
User avatar
barnetboy1
 
Posts: 1531
Joined: 21 Jan 2011, 18:18

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby jamiefrbees » 15 Feb 2011, 12:17

Why are we still all going on about managers.

At the end of the day it's the players on the pitch. Do you really think Sir Alex Ferguson could have us winning games if he stepped in? Maybe you do, I don't think so. Too much emphasis is placed on the manager sometimes. It's the aggregate ability of the players out there that matters and for a short while Fairclough was able to make it perform greater than the sum of its parts (aka Bradford and Northampton) etc and visibly improved individual confidence. He can't, however, work miracles.

As the Torquay fans were singing. 'It's a nurrseryy, it's a nurseryy'
Barnet, Barnet, Barnet, because...we're staying up, and it's the bondz the bondz the bondz the bondz the bondz the bondz the bondz that will keep us together...

Why does it always fall to Togwell?
jamiefrbees
 
Posts: 3496
Joined: 24 Jan 2011, 11:46

Re: We haven't improved under Fairclough

Postby buzzlightyear » 15 Feb 2011, 15:09

jamiefrbees wrote:Why are we still all going on about managers.

At the end of the day it's the players on the pitch. Do you really think Sir Alex Ferguson could have us winning games if he stepped in? Maybe you do, I don't think so. Too much emphasis is placed on the manager sometimes. It's the aggregate ability of the players out there that matters and for a short while Fairclough was able to make it perform greater than the sum of its parts (aka Bradford and Northampton) etc and visibly improved individual confidence. He can't, however, work miracles.

As the Torquay fans were singing. 'It's a nurrseryy, it's a nurseryy'


Unless you think we will survive the drop on the same players and same management you must think we have the worst/2nd worst players in the League. Did no one see that coming until it was late?

Without resorting to inaccurate statements about how much less we spend than other clubs (not true and not relevant compared to other financially secure minnows) why do you think we have ended up with such a poor bunch of players?

Unfortunately we look doomed based on the on-the-field strength be that management, players, or both. tbh we are unlikely to survive if we do take drastic measures, but I don't think we will, so a Stockport or Torquay-style revival is not gonna happen. So we'll join Halifax, Chester and Scarboro' as not coming back, except we'll manage to do it without the massive expenditure on a new ground or financial meltdown...

It's all very well arguing with others that they are wrong but what reasons for us going down do you think are the cause? Just saying 'it's the players' and 'it's not the management' isn't good enough. Why is it the players? Are we unlucky in having such a poor bunch? Are the players probably ok but the fans aren't encouraging them?

Or is it all down to the previous manager? If so then why was he allowed to continue for so long, and if you're so certain it's the players what have you got against throwing the dice and trying out someone else just in case the players improve?

Cos throwing the dice is all we can do now.
User avatar
buzzlightyear
 
Posts: 259
Joined: 23 Jan 2011, 23:18

Previous

Return to General Barnet Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 25 guests