Wes Fonguck

Anything and everything related to Barnet FC

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby StephenM » 21 Aug 2019, 12:42

becbee wrote:
Mr Smart wrote:
hoofer2 wrote:
Mr Smart wrote:I’m led to believe there was a breakdown in relationship with TK and the agent over something initially quite petty and unrelated to the contract which affected negotiations. Taking Wes out of the country so Barnet don’t receive a fee appears to be an FU to TK.


And an FU to Wes who must be gutted now has no club having had a decent breakthrough season. TK having an uneasy relationship with some agents may well be a contributory
factor as why we have not picked up one of Currie's striker targets.


I do and I don’t feel for Wes. On one hand he got sent home from preseason and was sat on his bum waiting for something to happen when he just wanted to play but on the flip side he’s entrusted his agent who’s one of the better ones, to manage the next stage. It could come off for him, it might not. A lot of decisions in life have some element of risk


We are not talking about a child here, we're talking about a 22 year old man who should be capable of telling his agent whether he wants to go abroad, to find a new club in this country or to simply stay put. The rest of us have to make our own decisions re our careers, with only perhaps consultation with our families -not just listen to someone who has his own personal vested interest.

The difference between us and footballers is that footballers are fick.
StephenM
 
Posts: 774
Joined: 16 Jul 2015, 11:56

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby Norfolkbee » 21 Aug 2019, 13:22

As Col Tom Parker said when Val Parnell offered Elvis Presley £100,000 to appear on Sunday Night at the London Palladium: "One hundred thousand is fine by me, but what about some money for my boy?"
Norfolkbee
 
Posts: 3282
Joined: 23 Jan 2011, 09:43

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby hoppy » 21 Aug 2019, 13:58

Norfolkbee wrote:As Col Tom Parker said when Val Parnell offered Elvis Presley £100,000 to appear on Sunday Night at the London Palladium: "One hundred thousand is fine by me, but what about some money for my boy?"


Blimey. I bet Val Parnell was all shook up!
hoppy
 
Posts: 3083
Joined: 15 Mar 2012, 09:43

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby Sparkles » 21 Aug 2019, 21:15

Let’s imagine a young free scoring highly rated midfield player is attracting Interest from lots of clubs in England and abroad. Let us also imagine the player is soon to be out of contract and does not want to sign a new one because the contract is derisory and he has a big opportunity to progress . Then let’s imagine an egocentric Chairman who sees this only as an opportunity to make as much money out of the player as possible. He therefore interferes with selection telling the manager not to play him trying to force the player into the new contract. (Players everywhere know this is the way at this imaginary club and are very wary of signing for them). The player and/or his agent want a move so run the contract out but until he is 24 compensation is due as it should be. But the Chairman is chasing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow setting his demands for compensation way over the odds. At the same time he stops the player playing to ‘punish’ him and let the others know that they are effectively shackled until they are 24.

Couldn’t happen...Who would want to be a footballer at a club like that?
Sparkles
 
Posts: 184
Joined: 09 Mar 2015, 22:57

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby Anthony » 21 Aug 2019, 22:14

Sparkles wrote:Let’s imagine a young free scoring highly rated midfield player is attracting Interest from lots of clubs in England and abroad. Let us also imagine the player is soon to be out of contract and does not want to sign a new one because the contract is derisory and he has a big opportunity to progress . Then let’s imagine an egocentric Chairman who sees this only as an opportunity to make as much money out of the player as possible. He therefore interferes with selection telling the manager not to play him trying to force the player into the new contract. (Players everywhere know this is the way at this imaginary club and are very wary of signing for them). The player and/or his agent want a move so run the contract out but until he is 24 compensation is due as it should be. But the Chairman is chasing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow setting his demands for compensation way over the odds. At the same time he stops the player playing to ‘punish’ him and let the others know that they are effectively shackled until they are 24.

Couldn’t happen...Who would want to be a footballer at a club like that?


Let’s imagine a midfielder who is highly rated by Barnet fans. Then let’s imagine him being called up to the Ireland U21 team and getting three caps. Then let’s imagine him being out of contact. Then let’s imagine him signing a three year deal. Only we don’t have to imagine that, because it actually happened.

But your last question is a valid one. And the answer is Jack Taylor preferred it over Wes. Would you rather Jack or Wes? And even if you prefer Wes, you must accept that if TK was the wicked witch of the west you paint him out to be, JT would surely have never signed the deal?
Anthony
 
Posts: 710
Joined: 22 Jan 2011, 17:22

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby Hiveoccupier » 21 Aug 2019, 22:37

Anthony wrote:
Sparkles wrote:Let’s imagine a young free scoring highly rated midfield player is attracting Interest from lots of clubs in England and abroad. Let us also imagine the player is soon to be out of contract and does not want to sign a new one because the contract is derisory and he has a big opportunity to progress . Then let’s imagine an egocentric Chairman who sees this only as an opportunity to make as much money out of the player as possible. He therefore interferes with selection telling the manager not to play him trying to force the player into the new contract. (Players everywhere know this is the way at this imaginary club and are very wary of signing for them). The player and/or his agent want a move so run the contract out but until he is 24 compensation is due as it should be. But the Chairman is chasing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow setting his demands for compensation way over the odds. At the same time he stops the player playing to ‘punish’ him and let the others know that they are effectively shackled until they are 24.

Couldn’t happen...Who would want to be a footballer at a club like that?


Let’s imagine a midfielder who is highly rated by Barnet fans. Then let’s imagine him being called up to the Ireland U21 team and getting three caps. Then let’s imagine him being out of contact. Then let’s imagine him signing a three year deal. Only we don’t have to imagine that, because it actually happened.

But your last question is a valid one. And the answer is Jack Taylor preferred it over Wes. Would you rather Jack or Wes? And even if you prefer Wes, you must accept that if TK was the wicked witch of the west you paint him out to be, JT would surely have never signed the deal?


Did Jack Taylor get the same contract offer as Fonguck ?

I would be surprised if he didn't get a much better offer with a clause that allows him to move to a higher level if a suitable transfer offer comes in. If not maybe he should be engaging the services of a better agent.
Hiveoccupier
 
Posts: 3356
Joined: 02 Feb 2011, 16:59

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby MCB » 22 Aug 2019, 07:51

Sparkles wrote:But the Chairman is chasing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow setting his demands for compensation way over the odds. At the same time he stops the player playing to ‘punish’ him and let the others know that they are effectively shackled until they are 24.

Couldn’t happen...Who would want to be a footballer at a club like that?


Except the fee would be set at tribunal if the clubs can't agree and a fair and equitable amount based on what we've invested in Wes and his potential.

If no one agrees to goto tribunal they fundamentally want him 'on the cheap' so our contract offer was the best on the market for Wes. I expect our chairman would have accepted less than the tribunal amount.
User avatar
MCB
 
Posts: 3283
Joined: 11 May 2016, 17:41

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby John_c » 22 Aug 2019, 08:23

Wes clearly had a fall out. Looks like stubbornness on both sides trying to resolve it. Now Wes is being hawked round lower league European sides just to avoid the chance of BFC getting a fee. This is NOT to further his career. I would question the mindset of a player and agent who chooses an option like that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
:geahh:

Proud Sponsor of Luisma Villa Lopez's Football Conference Winning Away Shirt. Season 2014/15

"Can't wait to hear the latest excuses from that bell end John C"
User avatar
John_c
 
Posts: 4928
Joined: 23 Jan 2011, 08:23

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby hoofer2 » 22 Aug 2019, 09:30

Sparkles wrote:Let’s imagine a young free scoring highly rated midfield player is attracting Interest from lots of clubs in England and abroad. Let us also imagine the player is soon to be out of contract and does not want to sign a new one because the contract is derisory and he has a big opportunity to progress . Then let’s imagine an egocentric Chairman who sees this only as an opportunity to make as much money out of the player as possible. He therefore interferes with selection telling the manager not to play him trying to force the player into the new contract. (Players everywhere know this is the way at this imaginary club and are very wary of signing for them). The player and/or his agent want a move so run the contract out but until he is 24 compensation is due as it should be. But the Chairman is chasing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow setting his demands for compensation way over the odds. At the same time he stops the player playing to ‘punish’ him and let the others know that they are effectively shackled until they are 24.

Couldn’t happen...Who would want to be a footballer at a club like that?


Or....imagine an agent who has Jordan Sancho etc. on his books...and Wes. The agent paints a picture of a false reality of what a footballer in National League can achieve and what they deserve and unsettles them - you're too
good for Barnet etc. -( Wes progress was good last season but not sure if League Two / League One player yet as needed at least one more season to cement place in first XI). Having had head turned and sentiment that you are too
good for Barnet, agent is looking to inflate a players worth as they will benefit financially with a larger piece of pie the bigger the deal. Club looks at player and acknowledges that while they are a good squad player, but not first name on teamsheet as per Jack Taylor, or Loach and offers a contract the matches the position in the squad pecking order as want to hold some funds back to secure a out and out goalscorer.

The rules about academy compensation are in black and white and are ultimately designed to prevent the big clubs from paying large transfer fees as per Andy Clarke or Dougie Freedman so they can sign players and pillage other clubs academies at a snip, whereas further down the hierarchy clubs are compromised due to the high fees. This smacks of agent throwing toys out the pram as Barnet are aware that compensation is likely to be higher than any transfer fee due. Barnet have supported Wes in the academy to get where he has so far and are entitled to play by the rules on this even if we do not agree with them. The biggest casualty in all this is Wes especially if he does not get a club soon.

And regarding the 11 year old in the article, Parents not reading the small print to get kids into academy at all costs and pretending they did not know further on down the line when rules are enforced.
Last edited by hoofer2 on 22 Aug 2019, 11:15, edited 2 times in total.
hoofer2
 
Posts: 3381
Joined: 01 Feb 2011, 13:48

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby #Beebot » 22 Aug 2019, 09:37

John_c wrote:Wes clearly had a fall out. Looks like stubbornness on both sides trying to resolve it. Now Wes is being hawked round lower league European sides just to avoid the chance of BFC getting a fee. This is NOT to further his career. I would question the mindset of a player and agent who chooses an option like that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It depends where. If it's a top half, top flight team in a Scandinavian league or one of the stronger Eastern European leagues, that's a good move. Second tier in one of the big 5 leagues or the Netherlands will also be a decent platform, as would a team from a smaller league who have a solid track record in Europe (like APOEL, Legia Warsaw, Red Star/Partizan etc).

Anywhere more obscure and it's probably a waste of time.
#Beebot
 
Posts: 2738
Joined: 04 Feb 2016, 19:54

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby Hiveoccupier » 22 Aug 2019, 11:10

MCB wrote:
Sparkles wrote:But the Chairman is chasing the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow setting his demands for compensation way over the odds. At the same time he stops the player playing to ‘punish’ him and let the others know that they are effectively shackled until they are 24.

Couldn’t happen...Who would want to be a footballer at a club like that?


Except the fee would be set at tribunal if the clubs can't agree and a fair and equitable amount based on what we've invested in Wes and his potential.

If no one agrees to goto tribunal they fundamentally want him 'on the cheap' so our contract offer was the best on the market for Wes. I expect our chairman would have accepted less than the tribunal amount.


There is a standard rate card that applies to the transfer of player registrations for players who have been through the academy system, IIRC Barnet's academy is designated at level 2 which attracts rates of £3k per year up to 11 years old and £25k from 12-16. Assuming Wes joined at U9 level |I think this would set the starting point for any negotiation at £134k.
Hiveoccupier
 
Posts: 3356
Joined: 02 Feb 2011, 16:59

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby Sparkles » 22 Aug 2019, 15:29

Wes started at Barnet in the youth team at 17 I think. Not sure what that would mean in terms of a standard rate but clearly the club want more or he doesn’t play....for anyone.
Sparkles
 
Posts: 184
Joined: 09 Mar 2015, 22:57

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby Ajtheone04 » 22 Aug 2019, 20:25

John_c wrote:
It depends where. If it's a top half, top flight team in a Scandinavian league or one of the stronger Eastern European leagues, that's a good move. Second tier in one of the big 5 leagues or the Netherlands will also be a decent platform, as would a team from a smaller league who have a solid track record in Europe (like APOEL, Legia Warsaw, Red Star/Partizan etc).

Anywhere more obscure and it's probably a waste of time.

The thing is, looking at it from the players point of view, these eastern European clubs are full or racism. I'm sure we all know about Malcolm being abused on his debut by his own fans after a club record signing
It could ruin someone like Wes who still has a long mental journey to undertake
Ajtheone04
 
Posts: 93
Joined: 05 May 2019, 12:51

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby StephenM » 23 Aug 2019, 11:32

#Beebot wrote:
John_c wrote:Wes clearly had a fall out. Looks like stubbornness on both sides trying to resolve it. Now Wes is being hawked round lower league European sides just to avoid the chance of BFC getting a fee. This is NOT to further his career. I would question the mindset of a player and agent who chooses an option like that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It depends where. If it's a top half, top flight team in a Scandinavian league or one of the stronger Eastern European leagues, that's a good move. Second tier in one of the big 5 leagues or the Netherlands will also be a decent platform, as would a team from a smaller league who have a solid track record in Europe (like APOEL, Legia Warsaw, Red Star/Partizan etc).

Anywhere more obscure and it's probably a waste of time.

If he thinks he'll make a career at a club at that level he's very much mistaken, you're talking Europa League teams. I know I don't rate him at all but even so, that is a huge step up from Barnet.
StephenM
 
Posts: 774
Joined: 16 Jul 2015, 11:56

Re: Wes Fonguck

Postby justiceseeker » 23 Aug 2019, 11:38

The fact that this Thread has become Barnet Fc chat rooms main topic of conversation this week says a lot about the level of excitement and expectation that we have as fans this season.

Sent from my CLT-L09 using Tapatalk
justiceseeker
 
Posts: 14
Joined: 22 Aug 2018, 14:03

PreviousNext

Return to General Barnet Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 37 guests